Why is it always unionist who go on about Braveheart? Some English unitroll has done it twice to me on the Steve Bell thread in The Guardian!
I’ve heard a rumour that whilst watching the documentary Frank Miller’s 300, the Con-Dems thought that the curiously Scots-accented King Leonidas was giving them a suggestion:
“Give them nothing, but take from them everything.”
And that really does seem to be the policy that they, Labour, and Better Together have taken to heart! Well, except for all that manure they keep giving us. And possibly the radioactive waste.
“We’re not in Braveheart, there’s lots of other things going on!” WTF does this actually mean, what point is that girl trying to make? Also if we had got our independence a 100 years ago are these people saying we would not eductaion, defence and shipbuilding? NOrons the lot of them
creag an tuirc
I remember once when Scotland was about to vote YES-YES in the Devolution referendum, Peter Hitchins of the Daily Mail (at the time) wrote a piece on how Scotland owed everything to the British Empire and if it wasn’t part of the Empire then it wouldn’t have become a developed country. Purely offensive drivel and indicative of the mindset of the London media. Of course we see that attitude among newspaper web comments of how ‘ungrateful’ the chippy Scots are.
Completely off topic (apologies). I’ve just had a thought. Oil around the Falkland Islands!
I read an article recently, by Ian Bell, a few saturdays ago, where he stated there is an estimated 60 billion barrells of oil around the Falkland’s waters. If that is correct an Independent Scotland would be entitled to circa 8.4%. A quick calculation assuming $100 a barrell would equate to circa £400 billion. £160 billion of tax revenue????
ronald alexander mcdonald
“£160 billion of tax revenue????”
As the oil wont be extracted by 2014, or even 2016 probably, it wont be anything to do with Scotland. Besides, thats the same argument as those who claim Scotland wouldn’t get it’s geographic share of North Sea oil somehow. The rUK are welcome to it in the future, although I think the Falklands will be looking for a very good deal with a cut of the revenue. I suspect Argentina will also get a cut, actually.
I thought should I click on the video or not? I did and got a bit confused at the mixed messages in the video then realised it is a parody of a BT video.
“Completely off topic (apologies). I’ve just had a thought. Oil around the Falkland Islands!”
I actually have something in the, er, pipeline about that.
Rev. Stuart Campbell
“We’re not in Braveheart – there’s a lot of other things going on.”
I stood up at the recent Yes Scotland event in Edinburgh to make the point that with an awful lot of people, before we get to thrust and parry with GDP stats and the like, we are going to have wade through a helluva lot of mince from folk like this poor woman who genuinely equate the cause of independence with chest thumping patriotism and/or anti-English sentiment.
Yes, there are many who affect that shite just to wind us up – but many more are so ignorant of the arguments, of what this IS ACTUALLY ALL ABOUT, that they can deliver such wrong-headed tosh with real conviction.
Before we guide a great many of our fellow Scots through the further education of constitutional change, economic freedom and social responsibility – we’re going to have to get them through Primary One!
“This is where you live.”
“This is how you’re governed.”
“This is what you can do about it …”
Any chance of postponing the referendum Alex?
Stu, 60billion barrells wasn’t a misprint then.
ronald alexander mcdonald
“As the oil wont be extracted by 2014, or even 2016 probably, it wont be anything to do with Scotland”
Some things will be on geographic share – resources, for example kind of have to be. But the assets and liabilities of the UK will have to be split by population, or some other means. So that would mean the Falklands and other overseas territories, and any other UK assets being valued and divvied up in the same way the national debt will be.
I’d imagine, for simplicity, they’ll find a value for both assets and liabilities,subtract one from the other and the balance will be what’s owed at separation. I’m sure it’s actually far,far more complex than that, but that’s about the limit my brain will cope with right now.
OMG I used the word “separation” seriously. Sorry. I mean, on independence
You should go and sit in the darkened room Cath
More of this please, hits the nail on the head.
On this Braveheart thing, everytime it gets peddled out I feel like slapping the face from which it was uttered. It is a unionist construct, I’ve heard no one, not a soul use the film as an example or reason to support independence, its just risible.
Is there not a unionist equivalent with which we can slap them around the head? Perhaps Till Death Us Do Part (not a film but apt given the title.)
Noone’s ever actually mentioned Braveheart to me, but I seem to see it online quite a bit. But, if someone actually DOES mention it to me, I will simply ask them what exactly it is that they’re trying to communicate by using this term. I will ask them to define what they mean. Then we can have a proper conversation.
Braveheart; if it means I have the courage of my convictions and the heart to stand for what I believe is in my country’s best interest…. I’ll wear their supposed slur with pride.
As for the unionists, take your pick; quislings, haw haws, vichies etc, etc
Better Together my Arse
The Army General lined up to be the new chief at Leuchars has already said.
The Runway will be ripped up cos they need the space for army training! Like theres not enough space there already.
If the Army get their hands on it they would put it financially beyond flight ops use
Benefits of Subjugation no. 101
Braveheart won 5 Oscars I believe. It’s rated 8.4 on iMDB http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0112573/?ref_=sr_1 same as great films like Lawrence of Arabia, LA Confidential and The Third Man and better than Raging Bull (8.3) or Trainspotting (8.2)
Unionists hate it because it presents history from a Scottish perspective.
ok it’s crap.
Makes me so happy to see this vid featured in one of Rev Stu’s posts.
On the topic of Falkland’s oil – why would anyone think we had a chance of benefitting from oil around the Falkland’s, given that we were barely allowed to benefit from the oil in our own territorial waters?
Even if we remain in the UK, Falkland’s oil revenue will not be coming to Scotland in any appreciable amounts.
“I actually have something in the, er, pipeline about that.”
Please let it be that a non-imperial Scotland doesn’t want to get involved?
I’ve never seen Braveheart and I won’t watch it until after Independence, and then it will only be to find out what those Labour numpties were on about.
By the way Rev, I liked the way you ended with the ‘wee dugs and sausage rolls’ guy on the voiceover… class.
SSP North Ayrshire are having a wee street stall in Irvine tomorrow, near the end of Bridgegate (if the cops and shopowners and construction site managers don’t hassle us away, as has happened before). If you see us, please take a minute to talk to us – we’re nice. Seriously. We are. Richie Venton is the SSP regional organiser for West of Scotland – he got a good article into NNS this week, all positive stuff. Check it out: http://newsnetscotland.com/index.php/scottish-opinion/6663-trade-unionists-for-independence
@ creag an tuirc
Where’s the MOT cert? Every answer it’s all the nationalists fault for giving no answers! Waffle from start to finish and I want my half hour back.
Don’t think that Britishunity site appreciate the video…there is a call to down vote it on utube! (vote no to scottish indy blah blah site)
I’m so sorry, I didn’t watch it myself due to reading the drivel in the accompanying article, which smelt of shite. Now I will definitely not watch it and save myself an half hour at your expense, cheers
creag an tuirc
I feel your pain, Ian. I was out on a main street in East Dunbartonshire last weekend, in the freezing cold,on behalf of the Yes campaign, politely asking passers-by whether they might be interested in reading a leaflet on independence for Scotland. I was studiously ignored for a bit, followed by one “Fuck Naw”, followed by an emphatic “Definitely not, I’m voting the opposite way”, followed by an “Only if you get rid of Alex Salmond”, then joy – I was approached by a lady who was obviously seeking me out. I kind of got my hopes up, only to have them cruelly dashed when she requested I move away from her cafe window in case I put her customers off. Somewhat dispirited, especially as I had hoped she might, at the very least, have offered me a hot cup of tea as compensation, given that it was freezing,I crossed the road to the front of the shopping centre because there was a man there, just outside the doors, trying to sell Sky packages and he looked even sadder than I did and everyone knows misery loves company. Five minutes or so later, out came a security guard and told me there was an invisible line around the shopping centre entrance and I was not allowed to cross it. Because I couldn’t actually see the invisible line she was referring to, she helpfully “walked the line” for me and gesticulated with her hands where I could and could not stand- this side of the invisible line good, that side bad. Then she told me the whole thing all over again, just to be sure. But either for good measure or in the interests of clarity, in case I didn’t get it the first two times, despite the helpful visual aids, she explained a third time – you can stand there but not here. By this time both the Sky guy and I were having some trouble keeping a straight face, but I duly took a couple of steps to the left so I was outside the “Forbidden Zone” ……and immediately got 6 passers-by to take leaflets! Thank you wee security wumman for your helpful advice. Good luck tomorrow, Ian.
Cheers for that. I’m glad you brought this up, because when I’ve mentioned it to folk they give me that look as if ‘aye, okay Ian, alright, what-ev-er’. But it’s true. These shopping malls extend way beyond their doors. Few weeks ago, also in Irvine, we were collecting signatures for a petition against the energy companies ripping us all off. It helped our cause that it was fucking freezing – I was wearing ALL the clothes I own, but still couldn’t stop shivering. Anyway, I was standing at my chosen spot, not far from the knackered wallpaper table with the petition on it, happily engaging the Great Unwashed with my winning smile and inimitable patter, when another of the guys came across to me and explained that I was on the wrong side of the ‘invisible line’ you mentioned. At first I didn’t know what he was on about, thought perhaps the cold had frozen whatever part of the brain it is that processes simple information. I think he was almost embarrassed to tell me, but it was true enough. The line he indicated is where the shopping trolleys automatically freeze. By taking six steps to my left (which, as an SSP member, I’m always happy to do) I was in the ‘safe’ zone.
I wonder if folk realise, when they enter these ‘zones’, that they’re being controlled as much as they are – apart from anything else, there’s nowhere to sit unless you’ve a spare two quid to buy a coffee.
Can’t help wondering if you, I, or anyone else who happens to espouse a particular cause, would be allowed to walk through these places wearing a badge, or carrying a flag, or exhibiting any evidence which smacks, however vaguely, of something ‘political’ – presumably the security staff in these places are trained, know what to look out for.
I intend to commission a ‘Braveheart Onesie’ – I’ll wear it with pride, walk through the Rivergate in Irvine, see what happens, and get back to you.
“Some things will be on geographic share – resources, for example kind of have to be. But the assets and liabilities of the UK will have to be split by population, or some other means. So that would mean the Falklands and other overseas territories, and any other UK assets being valued and divvied up in the same way the national debt will be.”
I’m not sure, if we ignore the oil around the Falklands then we might theoretically get a share of the overseas assets, but there aren’t really any assets there. Some sheep. There isnt anything there of value to divide up.
The oil will be (in the future) a geographic resource, and won’t be even in part something we are entitled to, because it will be after independence. Thats my reading of it anyway. If there were expensive assets there today, installations, gold reserves, a large chunk of military assets, then yes, we would get a cut in value terms. But the oil will be future geographic resources.
Why should the Falklands become a rUK asset? Surely a joint sovereignty arrangement could be agreed.
Didn’t Scottish squaddies die to keep the Falklands British? As Scottish taxes have also helped fund a “task force”, extend military capabilities, and whatever else around the world, I would expect an fair division of all known and expected assets. That includes mineral deposits under Saxe-Coburg and Gothaland.
Well, that’s interesting. It seems that Better Together have copyrighted their campaign materials, since the vid has been removed on copyright grounds. Is that normal, for political material? Shouldn’t that be counted under “fair use”, and satirical manipulation of it be counted as free speech? There are plenty of funny pastiches of Romney’s adverts on Youtube, as well as stuff from Tory and Labour campaigns…
I know Better Together are constituted as a company, but if they are going to put a copyright all their campaign material, and police it pro-actively, then one may feel one’s political freedom of expression has been constrained.
Billy: If you want to email or upload a copy somewhere, I’ll happily host it.
“Shouldn’t that be counted under “fair use”, and satirical manipulation of it be counted as free speech?”
There isn’t actually a “fair use” clause in UK copyright law. However, there are also no grounds for legal action over a case like this. YouTube are just pussies who take down everything anyone complains about as a default response.
Rev. Stuart Campbell
Thanks Rev, I appreciate the advice and the offer of hosting, but both those videos need tightening up and fine-tuning anyway (second one needs more stuff in it too). Better Together have done me a favour in a way. I’d actually expected a copyright claim from Big Country. : )
I’d actually expected a copyright claim from Big Country. : )
I’d rather like it if that one came back to bite them on the bum, say 5 weeks before the Referendum?